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Post by BarbK on Jul 16, 2015 22:15:12 GMT -5
I was watching a female House Sparrow today poking around the grass and thought about how they were brought over here from England to help fight off an insect. I believe it was some kind of beetle. It made me wonder if House Sparrows would have made their own way here on their own, eventually. With the speed of ships these days, it would be nothing for them to stow away (guess they're already doing this). If they came here on their own, would they still be called Aliens, as I've seen them called on other forums. I believe the same situation holds with Starlings.
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Post by luv2bird on Jul 17, 2015 9:06:41 GMT -5
I was watching a female House Sparrow today poking around the grass and thought about how they were brought over here from England to help fight off an insect. I believe it was some kind of beetle. It made me wonder if House Sparrows would have made their own way here on their own, eventually. With the speed of ships these days, it would be nothing for them to stow away (guess they're already doing this). If they came here on their own, would they still be called Aliens, as I've seen them called on other forums. I believe the same situation holds with Starlings.
They are an invasive alien birds, starlings and house sparrows, are cavity nesters, they destroy our native birds' eggs and babies, (Blue Birds, Woodpeckers and House Wrens ect.), then take over the bird box or cavity in a tree.
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Post by BarbK on Jul 17, 2015 12:48:00 GMT -5
I'm very much aware of the damage House Sparrows do to our Blue Birds, etc., destroying eggs and taking over bird boxes. My question was if they came here under their own power on ships, etc., rather than have been taken here physically by people who thought they would eradicate a certain insect, would they still be considered aliens. I think with the speed of ships today, the birds would easily stow away and eventually arrive here on their own.
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Post by Calamity Creek Gal on Jul 19, 2015 7:39:13 GMT -5
Good question. Maybe they would still have some negative status, not born here - thus an illegal immigrant. Much like humans are treated...
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Post by BarbK on Jul 19, 2015 10:45:41 GMT -5
Hi Lue, thanks for your reply. I guess the House Sparrows would have come here either way, and we are stuck with them. I'm getting a lot of them at my feeders these days whereas before, I rarely had them. I think it's due to less trees I have due to Sandy. I'm also getting a lot of Cowbirds. It does not make me happy to see these birds at the feeders.
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Post by hazelrunmama on Jul 19, 2015 13:04:54 GMT -5
I think they'd be considered invasive, even it they made it here on their own. At least if it was a large barrier, like an ocean, that separated them from the new range. Certainly organisms that hitchhiked over the ocean in the ballast of colonial ships are considered invasive. Even house finches east of the Rockies have a quasi-negative status here--and they do negatively impact local populations of other finches, in particular, purple finches. Taking it one step further--I consider the cowbirds to be invasive here. They are plains birds originally, and the only reason they are here in the forest is because of man-made changes (fragmentation of forest by road-building and power-line rights-of-way). Forest birds have no evolutionary experience with coping with cowbirds so they're hit hard by them if they're in reach.
So regardless of how they get here, if they don't belong, they'd still be listed as 'alien' in my book...
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Post by Calamity Creek Gal on Jul 19, 2015 13:13:22 GMT -5
Hi Barb, miss your bathing cardinal pictures. Cowbirds are part of the landscape here, and I don't have large numbers. Same with HOSP.
Your comments make sense HRM, and interesting about the HOFI east of the Rockies. Man's impact on habitat is a major issue, I think.
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Post by luv2bird on Jul 19, 2015 14:37:57 GMT -5
I was watching a female House Sparrow today poking around the grass and thought about how they were brought over here from England to help fight off an insect. I believe it was some kind of beetle. It made me wonder if House Sparrows would have made their own way here on their own, eventually. With the speed of ships these days, it would be nothing for them to stow away (guess they're already doing this). If they came here on their own, would they still be called Aliens, as I've seen them called on other forums. I believe the same situation holds with Starlings.
They are an invasive alien birds, starlings and house sparrows, are cavity nesters, they destroy our native birds' eggs and babies, (Blue Birds, Woodpeckers and House Wrens ect.), then take over the bird box or cavity in a tree.
Sorry BarbK, here's what I have found on the E. Starling: They were imported, in 1890, by a Shakespearean zealot by the name of Eugene Scheifflin. He released 60 Starlings in New York City's Central Park and 40 more the following year. Scheifflen wanted to transplant all the birds mentioned in Shakespeare to the new world. All starlings today are descendants of these birds.
House Sparrow: A Brooklynite, Nicolas Pike, imported House Sparrows from England, in early 1850's, they multiplied and spread quickly. House Sparrows would, sometimes get trapped inside railroad cars and be transported across the country. Then, later on, was imported by other cities, in 1875 St. Louis, also towns in Texas, Utah, California and some in New England States including New York imported them.
Referance Book: Book of North American Birds published by Reader's Digest.
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Post by BarbK on Jul 19, 2015 15:01:54 GMT -5
All excellent and interesting opinions and also very informative. I knew I would have my questions answered on this forum. Thank you, Hazel, Lue, and Luv2.
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Post by BarbK on Jul 19, 2015 21:28:33 GMT -5
Lue, thanks for mentioning my Cardinal photos. My Cardinal couple are always around.
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Post by downylover on Jul 22, 2015 12:09:47 GMT -5
Hi Lue, thanks for your reply. I guess the House Sparrows would have come here either way, and we are stuck with them. I'm getting a lot of them at my feeders these days whereas before, I rarely had them. I think it's due to less trees I have due to Sandy. I'm also getting a lot of Cowbirds. It does not make me happy to see these birds at the feeders. I have more cowbirds this year than ever before. My sister never got them and has them as well. For me I don't think its since Sandy because I didn't have this many last year. I have more red winged blackbirds too yet probably less grackles. I only get starlings when they are bringing their babies to eat or when it snows and that's been the same. Losing trees during Sandy (whole neighborhood/town) has seemed to increase the number of hawks. I take just about any bird over a hawk  Oddly, I rarely get more than a handful of house sparrows. A couple of times a year I get a larger amount for a couple of weeks (usually early spring and in the fall) then I go back to just a handful. |
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